Emas

jebeng

Aku ade tgk NatGeo psl history of space....siri tu btau yg lpas bigbang...space ni hanya ade gumpalan hidrogen sahaja...then tarikan graviti yg menjadikan gumpalan ni seperti matahari...lepastu timbul la element seperti oksigen, carbon dan macam2 lg...

then aku teringt kisah ilmu kimia tercipta sbb org nk cipta emas...tp x berjaya...

topiknye ahli kimia dulu silap @ x psl penciptaan emas ni?...dr mane diorg tau? atau teori saje semata2...

emiliahani

cak tompang lalu...tatau nk komen

jebeng

Haha..xper...sbb aku ckp mcm tu ialah...matahari terhasil dari tindak balas termonucklear nye sumber dari hidrogen...2 hidrogen combine then hasilkan helium...and so on sehinggalah matahari/bintang tidak berupaya @ kureng tenaga die untk menggabung unsur yg lebih berat dr besi....

so camne lak unsur2 yg lagi berat dari besi cam plutonium..uranium..and so on...??..apabile sesuatu bintang tu mati..ade yg menghasilkan supernova dan itulah yg menglengkapkan periodic table..

leh ke teknologi skang split proton,neutron lpastu leh combine blik ikut kehendak msing??..

emiliahani

nat geo nk tengok kat tb brepe....lame tak tengok

jebeng

astro channel 553....xpon 555..lupe..huhu

meitantei

haha, berangan nak buat emas dalam bilik la ni...

secara teorinya, boleh tukar satu unsur itu kepada unsur yg lain. Cthnya dari unsur karbon kpd emas.

Caranya senang jer. Karbon ada 6 proton. Emas pulak ada 79 proton. Jadi, utk tukar karbon kpd emas, kita campak lagi 75 proton dlm setiap atom karbon, maka jadila karbon tu emas...

Masalahnya, teknik ni Giler giler punya mahal and tak praktikal. Lebih mahal dari emas tu sendiri. In other words, tak balik modal. Jadi korang lupakan jerla nak buat emas dalam bilik.

Historically, bidang kajian zaman dulu kala yg cuba cari cara menukar suatu benda kepada emas adalah "Alchemy". Tapi skrg dah pupus dah.

Atomic_Omnikid

Originally posted by <i>meitantei</i> at 10-10-2008 23:12 <a href="http://forum.cari.com.my/redirect.php?goto=findpost&pid=26356533&ptid=379692" target="_blank"><img src="http://forum.cari.com.my/images/common/back.gif" border="0" onload="if(this.width>screen.width*0.7) {this.resized=true; this.width=screen.width*0.7; this.alt='Click here to open new window\nCTRL+Mouse wheel to zoom in/out';}" onmouseover="if(this.width>screen.width*0.7) {this.resized=true; this.width=screen.width*0.7; this.style.cursor='hand'; this.alt='Click here to open new window\nCTRL+Mouse wheel to zoom in/out';}" onclick="if(!this.resized) {return true;} else {window.open(this.src);}" onmousewheel="return imgzoom(this);" alt="" /></a><br />
haha, berangan nak buat emas dalam bilik la ni...<br />
<br />
secara teorinya, boleh tukar satu unsur itu kepada unsur yg lain. Cthnya dari unsur karbon kpd emas.<br />
<br />
Caranya senang jer. Karbon ada 6 proto ...

<br />

kalo tak silap..unsur-unsur berat nie terhasil di teras matahari akibat tekanan tinggi,pastu akibat supernovae ia tersebar ke tempat lain..di matahari kalo tak silap emas yang jadik plumbum..terbalik aper yg alchemist cuba buat..alchemy kini dikenali sbg chemistry

jebeng

yeke?..method aper tu??..rasenye kalo chemistry mmg xleh dr unsur tukar unsur len...yg bertukar hanye la cas electron saje...kalo x silap la

jebeng

owh ade method tu...nuclear fussion...tp die mengeluarkan tenaga lak..mcm dh msk fizik lak...

aku_EnSeM

analisis ke atas unsur2 dlm bintang menunjukkan yg umur bintang berkadar songsang dengan peratusan unsur2 berat dlm bintang.

in other words, bintang2 baru ade byk unsur berat dlm die, manakala bintang2 lama sikit je...

ini adalah antara observation yg kukuhkan lagi suma teori psl pembentukan unsur berat dlm tindak balas nuklear. setiap kali bintang 'mat', unsur2 berat dimuntahkan keluar, n unsur2 ni akan digunakan utk buat bintang baru. psl tu bintang2 muda byk unsur berat...



fikir ape jd klu unsur berat makin dominan, so bintang sume 'malu2'...

cucusaddam

gigi emas tu 'berharga' tak...

meitantei

Originally posted by aku_EnSeM at 11-10-2008 08:20 PM

in other words, bintang2 baru ade byk unsur berat dlm die, manakala bintang2 lama sikit je...

terbalik la... bintang is mostly hydrogen and helium. Bila bintang tu dah kehabisan hydrogen utk wat nuclear fusion, maka tarikan graviti akan buat binatng tu collapse. Tekanan yg tinggi akan menghasilkan unsur2 yg lebih berat. kalau bintang tu kecik, waktu dia mati, akan jadi white dwarf, mostly dibuat drp unsur iron. Kenapa iron? sebab unsur2 yg lebih berat dr iron kalau nak fuse akan perlu tenaga dan bukan menghasilkan tenaga utk menentang tarikan graviti. Kalau bintang tu besar sgt, akan berlaku supernova and bintang tu akan jadi sama ada neutron star, atau black hole bergantung kpd jisim bintang tersebut...

teknik menukar karbon kpd emas yg aku ckp tadi tu dipanggil nuclear transmutation. Dlm makmal, saintis tak pernah tukar karbon kpd emas. Walaubagaimanapun, saintis pernah tukar plumbum kpd emas. Tapi harga eksperimen tu jauh lebih mahal dari harga emas tu sendiri.

jebeng

sbnarnye emas x sepnuhnye dari karbon...tp material yg berbeza atas dr iron die bergabung randomly time supernova..n bergtg jugak pada jenis sesuatu bintang tu..

cth possiblity ... ferum + silicon + carbon + litium + magnesium + blabla.... = Aurum

jebeng

cube bc ni...kalo dh dpt wat gold..mesti ade side effek kan..

LIVERMORE, California -- Scientists at the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory have discovered a process for inexpensively converting base metals into gold, the lab announced Tuesday night at a hastily called news conference.

Since medieval times the dream of alchemists has been to make gold, the exemplar of the precious metals, out of lead, the basest of the base metals. Heretofore this has been possible only through the use of particle accelerators and other devices of nuclear mechanics to remove three protons from each lead atom, a process requiring so much energy that it was far more costly than any gold that could be produced.

But Lab Director Stew Pidasso said Tuesday night the lab's scientists have produced economic quantities of the precious metal in a different way.

"The alchemists and the early nuclear scientists failed to realize that there's more than one way to skin a proton," Pidasso said. "Instead of trying to knock protons out of lead, protons can be borrowed from metals with lower atomic numbers and added to make gold."

Pidasso said the lab, a division of the U.S. Department of Energy, first achieved the transformation by borrowing protons from copper and nickel and adding them to bars of iron. But when copper and nickel supplies ran out, the lab began using protons from calcium, which is abundant in seashells along the nearby California coastline.

According to Pidasso, using proton borrowing and high-quality varnishes, the lab will be able to manufacture about 1,500 metric tonnes of gold per year, which, he predicted, might indefinitely fill what is estimated to be the gap between annual world gold demand and mine and scrap supply.

Pidasso said the laboratory's gold research long has been funded by grants from JPMorganChase & Co. and Goldman Sachs Group Inc. but that recently "enormous" help had been provided by Bear Stearns Cos.

The lab's announcement was expected to plunge the precious metals markets into chaos. A spokesman for the World Gold Council in London, reached late in the evening on his cell phone at a local club, would say only, "Young women in slinky outfits will look good in gold no matter how much of the stuff is available or where it comes from. Those details hardly matter to us."

aku_EnSeM

Originally posted by meitantei at 11-10-2008 10:55 PM


terbalik la... bintang is mostly hydrogen and helium. Bila bintang tu dah kehabisan hydrogen utk wat nuclear fusion, maka tarikan graviti akan buat binatng tu collapse. Tekanan yg tinggi akan ...

ape yg terbalik?

negative correlation between proportion of heavier elements and the age of star memang dh dibuktikan.

Astrophysicists dh nmpk yg bintang2 mude byk ferum dlm die compare to bintang yg dh tue.

And this is not to be confused with bintang2 yg dh hampir ke saat 'kematian'... Memang betul bintang2 yg sangat tua ade banyak heavy metal in them. But, in this context, astrophysisists compare proportion of heavier elements bagi bintang2 dlm stage yg similar, tp slightly different in their age. That is, bintang2 ni masih lagi convert hydrogen ke helium and the formation of heavy elements is not taking place. And they found for older stars, they have less ferum.

So what is the explanation?

Since these stars haven't converted anything to ferum, they must have come from the 'dust' that gave birth to these stars. And so, since by our theory of nuclear reaction states that stars create heavier elements, more and more elements that are heavy are being spit out each time a star dies. So the amount of heavy elements in the universe keeps increasing, which leads to a prediction that younger stars (provided that their nuclear reactions only convert H to He) contain more heavy elements than older stars.

This observation really strengthen our nuclear physics theories. If, however, astrophysicists found that the proportion of heavy elements in both young stars and old stars are similar, this somehow shows us that the amount of heavy elements in the universe is constant, which clearly violates our very first hypothesis that stars are the factories of heavy elements.

[ Last edited by  aku_EnSeM at 12-10-2008 03:52 PM ]

auntie_girl

nak komen, tak cukup ilmu di dada...

tapi dekat bod history kot, ada topik ni gak

Atomic_Omnikid

..akan ader satu masa nnt,beberapa googleplex akan datang,semua hidrogen di universe akan kehabisan,and all the shine will be gone.

silver_nano59

beberapa google plex,
mungkin ilmu ni tak termampu oleh manusia nak pikir kan,

cipanbakar

Originally posted by meitantei at 10-10-2008 11:12 PM

haha, berangan nak buat emas dalam bilik la ni...

secara teorinya, boleh tukar satu unsur itu kepada unsur yg lain. Cthnya dari unsur karbon kpd emas.

Caranya senang jer. Karbon ada 6 proton. Emas pulak ada 79 proton. Jadi, utk tukar karbon kpd emas, kita campak lagi 75 proton dlm setiap atom karbon, maka jadila karbon tu emas...

Masalahnya, teknik ni Giler giler punya mahal and tak praktikal. Lebih mahal dari emas tu sendiri. In other words, tak balik modal. Jadi korang lupakan jerla nak buat emas dalam bilik.

Historically, bidang kajian zaman dulu kala yg cuba cari cara menukar suatu benda kepada emas adalah "Alchemy". Tapi skrg dah pupus dah.

amenda ko merepek macha? mahal giler konon nak buat emas. brape mahal?

Caranya senang jer. Karbon ada 6 proton. Emas pulak ada 79 proton. Jadi, utk tukar karbon kpd emas, kita campak lagi 75 proton dlm setiap atom karbon, maka jadila karbon tu emas...

ko ingat macam tengah bancuh milo ka? campak milo dalam air, terus jadik air milo

cipanbakar

Originally posted by Atomic_Omnikid at 18-10-2008 11:08 PM
..akan ader satu masa nnt,beberapa googleplex akan datang,semua hidrogen di universe akan kehabisan,and all the shine will be gone.

helium pun dah cukup nak menerangi alam