|
|
Originally posted by KENNKID at 28-6-2006 10:52 AM
You're quoting bits and pieces, purposely out of context
Out of context my foot. 
The disire for the wealth of the Chosroes(Persian) and Caesar(Rome/Byzantine) is the reason for Muhammad to launch the attack against them in Battle of Muta and the battle of Tabuk.
[ Last edited by FaithHealer3 at 28-6-2006 11:10 AM ] |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by juwaini at 28-6-2006 10:57 AM
like what i said "a headline reader"..
thanks...
and you have no idea except attack using ad-hominem tactic.. f.y.i its a childish personal attacts.. not a good way to defend your evil cult.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
KENNKID This user has been deleted
|
Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 28-6-2006 11:04 AM
Out of context my foot.
The disire for the wealth of the Chosroes(Persian) and Caesar(Rome/Byzantine) is the reason for Muhammad to launch the attack against them in Battle of Muta and th ...
Keep your dirty foot to yourself..
If the desire was for wealth, the holy prophet would be and would have been remembered as a very rich man... is he?
:pray:http://www.al-islam.org/restatement/10.htm
:pray:http://www.angelfire.com/bug/j_abidbata/reform.html |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Iman_6 This user has been deleted
|
Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 28-6-2006 10:03 AM
Not lies but truth. Even you proved it yourself by giving the links to Muhammad's story.. the same story found in faithfreedom.org' library.
You should read the information in the link you g ...
Dear muslim brothers/sisters,
Just look at how dirty cheap lying skills, the enemies of Islam used to distort and manipulate the original version, and it aren抰 suprising at all after what they did to the original scriptures of Torah & Injeel.. But the pathethic part is that all this dirty manipulations are being seriously taken for the truth by people who wont want to think and do further research with their God given brain or to the atheist to do analytical thinking aside from logical thinking and direct acceptance of what is being served to them like 搈aggie mee |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
KENNKID This user has been deleted
|
Originally posted by Iman_6 at 28-6-2006 02:41 PM
Dear muslim brothers/sisters,
Just look at how dirty cheap lying skills, the enemies of Islam used to distort and manipulate the original version, and it aren抰 suprising at all after w ...
Alhamdulillah my sis in Islam, Iman... thank you.. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hear O Jews and Christians
"If only the People of the Book (Christians and Jews) had believed and been righteous, We should indeed have blotted out their iniquities and admitted them to gardens of bliss. "
(Surah Al-Maidah 5:65)
That is Allah promise |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 25-6-2006 01:04 PM
See the irony about quran reciding.. there are just too many muslims who read the quran verses in arabic without being able to understand the meaning.
This is a fact you cannot deny.
This proves that reading/reciding some arabic words without knowing the meaning of the word being read is useless and very stupid.
Go and check with your friend.. how many of them who been reading quran since young know the meaning. I already asked and the result is so bad.. more than half of them don't know what the hell they been reading.
It's more ironic when you even can't understand your whole bible written in English.This proves that reading your bible in English during your Sunday school are meanigless as you've failed many times when we debate regarding the bible long ago and that's the real reason why you've stop defending the bible words cause you know you cannot win and please stop acting like a skeptic Christian or an atheist just simply because you have no answer for the bible but you've proven many times that your love for the bible remains. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by wira_melayu at 29-6-2006 06:06 AM
It's more ironic when you even can't understand your whole bible written in English.This proves that reading your bible in English during your Sunday school are meanigless as you've failed many ...
he's an atheist... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by KENNKID at 28-6-2006 11:19 AM
Keep your dirty foot to yourself..
If the desire was for wealth, the holy prophet would be and would have been remembered as a very rich man... is he?
I can't understand why you guys are soooo afraid to acknowledge the facts about muhammad that he got rich by raiding pagan caravans and robbing the Jews.
He raided meccan caravan and stole their goods as war booties.
He attacked Medina Jew. He chase the Jews(Banu Nadir) from their land and took their property.
He killed some of Jews(Banu Qurayah) and took their wives and childred as slaves.
He become rich by taking 1/5 of the war booties. He was a head of a bunch of lanuns. Thats the only way he know how to get rich.
but.. like the saying goes.. "a fool and his money will soon part".
I ain't lying. Its all written in the hadiths about Muhammad. Why are you guys sooo blnd to the historical Muhammad?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by wira_melayu at 29-6-2006 06:06 AM
It's more ironic when you even can't understand your whole bible written in English.This proves that reading your bible in English during your Sunday school are meanigless as you've failed many ...
Is that all you got to defend you cult?
I don't think Bible is devine neither di i believe Jesus is Son of God, but i like many none violent message of Jesus.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
[quote]Originally posted by Iman_6 at 28-6-2006 02:41 PM
Just look at how dirty cheap lying skills, the enemies of Islam used to distort and manipulate the original version, and it aren抰 suprising at all after what they did to the original scriptures of Torah & Injeel.. But the pathethic part is that all this dirty manipulations are being seriously taken for the truth by people who wont want to think and do further research with their God given brain or to the atheist to do analytical thinking aside from logical thinking and direct acceptance of what is being served to them like 搈aggie mee |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 30-6-2006 01:50 AM
That a pretty lie there.
The Jews did not betray Muhammad. They saved Muhammad's life from the pagans from Meccan. By not joining the meccan and allowing the meccans to use their path claiming that it was sabbath, the Jews saved Muhammad and his friends. Since Muhammad had stole the property of another Jewish tribe, Banu Nadir, and chase away the Jew from the homes, the Jew (banu qurayza) have every right to protect themself from Muhammad, but they failed to protect themselves and paid the price with their lives. Had the Jew allowed the pagans to attack Muhammad and his gang, Muhammad would have been killed and the Jews would not have lost their heads to Muhammad's sword.
If there is ever an award for greatest ungrateful guy in history, it must go to Muhammad.
Instead of being grateful and rewarding the Jews, Muhammad murdered them. Muhammad beheaded all the adult Jew males from the tribe Bunu Qurayza. All male Jews who had pubic hair were beheaded that day. The Jewish women and childen become slaves.
From which historical source did you made the references?Bring it on to me i will refute it one by one.
Killing the fathers, husbands, brothers and forcing the womens into slavery.. may be merciful in your book but not in my book.
I salute the Jewish women Rayhana for turning down Muhammad's proposal. It takes a strong women to turn down a man who have absolute power over her. All the man from her tribe was beheaded, that would include father, husband and brothers relatives etc.
Killing fathers,husbands,brothers as a punishment for their crimes is justify.Remember in most countries today that there are many fathers,husband,brothers were hanged to death for their crimes such as drugs offenders,Serial rapist and murderers.Are you still sympathy with those human garbages?Certainly yes i guess :lol |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by wira_melayu at 30-6-2006 02:59 AM
From which historical source did you made the references?Bring it on to me i will refute it one by one.
You can't refute the works of ibn Ishaq. He wrote the story based on what he know.. and that was one of the oldest recording/hadiths.
I already gave the links in my previous post. You just too lazy to click on it.
anyway.. here's the links
http://www.witness-pioneer.org/v ... d_banu_qurayzah.htm
http://www.hraicjk.org/hadith/ibn_ishaq.html#banu_qurayza
its so weird.. muslims don't know real history of Muhammad.
Originally posted by wira_melayu at 30-6-2006 02:59 AM
Killing fathers,husbands,brothers as a punishment for their crimes is justify.Rememb ...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 30-6-2006 03:15 AM
You can't refute the works of ibn Ishaq. He wrote the story based on what he know.. and that was one of the oldest recording/hadiths.
I already gave the links in my previous post. You just too lazy to click on it.
anyway.. here's the links
http://www.witness-pioneer.org/v ... d_banu_qurayzah.htm
http://www.hraicjk.org/hadith/ibn_ishaq.html#banu_qurayza
its so weird.. muslims don't know real history of Muhammad.
...
I will be more than happy if you can post it here for discussion.
My foot. Killing all the adult males from a tribe is genocide.. never justified.. no matter what fake excuse you try to give.
It should be clear from the facts that in the light of their behavior preceding the judgment the Banu Qurayzah deserved a very strict punishment. Furthermore, it is also clear that the punishment was not decided by the Prophet (pbuh), but was actually decided by a person, who was appointed as arbitrator, by the Banu Qurayzah, themselves.
However, one may still be of the opinion that the Prophet (pbuh) should have softened the punishment, even if it was pronounced by an arbitrator, who was appointed by the Banu Qurayzah themselves. On the contrary, the Prophet (pbuh) not only upheld and implemented the decision pronounced by the arbitrator, but also commended it as: 'in accordance with God's law'.
To fully understand why the Prophet (pbuh) did not soften or alter the sentence pronounced by Sa`d ibn Mu`aaz, we should keep in mind that Banu Qurayzah were actually Jews, who were subject to the laws of the Torah. Deuteronomy 20: 10 - 14 says:
When you draw near to a town to fight against it, offer it terms of peace. If it accepts your terms of peace and surrenders to you, then all the people in it shall serve you at forced labor. If it does not submit to you peacefully, but makes war against you, then you shall besiege it; and when the LORD your God gives it into your hand, you shall put all its males to the sword. You may, however, take as your booty the women, the children, livestock, and everything else in the town, all its spoil. You may enjoy the spoil of your enemies, which the LORD your God has given you.
It was in accordance with this law that Moses (pbuh) ordered the killing of all the men of Midian and taking all their women and children as captives. Numbers 31: 7 - 11 read as:
They did battle against Midian, as the LORD had commanded Moses, and killed every male... The Israelites took the women of Midian and their little ones captive; and they took all their cattle, their flocks, and all their goods as booty. All their towns where they had settled, and all their encampments, they burned, but they took all the spoil and all the booty, both people and animals.
Certainly Sa`d ibn Mu`aaz's decision was in accordance with the directives of the Torah, which the Jews accepted to be divine.Thus, the Banu Qurayzah were, in fact, slaughtered by the sword of the Torah - the book, which they, themselves, held to be divine. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by wira_melayu at 30-6-2006 03:44 AM
I will be more than happy if you can post it here for discussion.
LOL.
Its islamic history. you can't refute that.
Originally posted by wira_melayu at 30-6-2006 03:44 AM
It should be clear from the facts that in the light of their behavior preceding the judgment the Banu Qurayzah deserved a very strict punishment.
Obviously the Jews of Banu Qurayza saved Muhammad life by
1) not joining the pagan in attacking Muhammad even though the agreement with pagan meccan's was that they will join them. The Jews refuse to join the pagan's claiming that it was sabbath.
2) not allowing the pagans to go thru their way. Since Muhammad had dig trench which prevents the pagan from attacking him, the only way for the pagans to reach Muhammad was thru the path of the Jews. The pagans were unable to attack because the Jew didn't cooperate with them. The Jew made a huge mistake by dishonoring their agreement with the meccan pagans.. and paid with their lives.
As for political reasons, Muhammad made a correct decision by murdering all the Jew males, so that there will be no future treat from them. Thats how dispicable warlords win wars.. genocine and backstabbing.. is small matter for them. Its a pre-empt strike. And it brought Muhammad all the wealth of the Jews.
If the present day Jews in Israel do the same thing to the arabs in west bank and gaza .. muslims will be crying foul but Muhammad did it.. and they don't see that its wrong.
Originally posted by wira_melayu at 30-6-2006 03:44 AM
Furthermore, it is also clear that the punishment was not decided by the Prophet (pbuh), but was actually decided by a person, who was appointed as arbitrator, by the Banu Qurayzah, themselves.
Didn't you read this " to negotiate with them. As he arrived, he was met by women and children in tears whose sight touched his heart. The Jews asked whether he counseled acquiescence to Muhammad's judgment. He answered, "By all means!" And, passing his hand over his throat, he said: "Otherwise, it will be a general carnage." Some biographer?s report that Abu Lubabah later regretted having given them this counsel.'
Muhammad already dicided to slaughter them. The Jews know this. The socalled arbitrator is Muhammad's war general. what else can you aspect from the enemy of the Jew but cold-blooded murder?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
eddom This user has been deleted
|
Originally posted by wira_melayu at 30-6-2006 02:59 AM
From which historical source did you made the references?Bring it on to me i will refute it one by one.
Killing fathers,husbands,brothers as a punishment for their crimes is justify.Rememb ...
cooool.... killing the father or family member of a person who done something wrong is right move???? WTF is in your mind?? Do you mean that if your family member killing somebody, then it is right to kill your whole family??? cooooooollllll...... i quite interest with what your point of view toward life...... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by wira_melayu at 30-6-2006 03:44 AM
To fully understand why the Prophet (pbuh) did not soften or alter the sentence pronounced by Sa`d ibn Mu`aaz, we should keep in mind that Banu Qurayzah were actually Jews, who were subject to the laws of the Torah. Deuteronomy 20: 10 - 14 says:
When you draw near to a town to fight against it, offer it terms of peace. If it accepts your terms of peace and surrenders to you, then all the people in it shall serve you at forced labor. If it does not submit to you peacefully, but makes war against you, then you shall besiege it; and when the LORD your God gives it into your hand, you shall put all its males to the sword. You may, however, take as your booty the women, the children, livestock, and everything else in the town, all its spoil. You may enjoy the spoil of your enemies, which the LORD your God has given you.
That law does not applly to the Jews of Banu Qurayza because
1) The Jews help Muhammad by saving his live from the pagans.. but Muhammad was not in peace with them.
2) The Jew offerd to surrender and wanted to leave town peacefully.. but Muhammad wanted the males dead and the womens and children as booty.
3) the law was for the Jews against others not the other way around.
4) Muhammad calims the Jew corrupted the torah.. so torah can't be used against them.
This also proves that Muhammad is as evil as the Jews.. for killing the Jews using the stupid torah.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Iman_6 This user has been deleted
|
To the hyporite liars out there,
I see no contradictions on the history of our beloved prophet from this two links.
http://www.witness-pioneer.org/v ... d_banu_qurayzah.htm
http://www.hraicjk.org/hadith/ibn_ishaq.html#banu_qurayza
The Jews had earlier made a peace treaty with the muslims called Medina Peace Pact which they violated.
From Wikipedia :
Medina Peace Pact
At Muhammad's insistence, Medina's pagan, Muslim and Jewish clans signed a pact to protect each other, but achieving this new social order was difficult.The objective of the pact was to try to end internal conflicts plus bring all medinites (or Medinans) together as one nation. Certain individual pagans and recent Medinan converts to Islam tried to thwart the new arrangement in various ways, and some of the Jewish clans were uneasy with the threatened demise of the old alliances. At least three times in five years, Jewish leaders, uncomfortable with the changing political situation in Medina, went against Muhammad, hoping to restore the tense, sometimes bloody-but predictable-balance of power among the tribes.
In the fifth year of Hijra, a group of those Jews including Sallam ibn Abi al-Huqayq and Huyayy ibn Akhtab, together with a number of Banu Wa抜l, left for Makka. They urged the Quraysh to make war on the Prophet Muhammad, upon him be peace and blessings, and promised help and support.
The Jewish group then went to the tribes of Ghatafan and Qays Aylan and guaranteeing them help also, encouraged them to fight against God抯 Messenger.
You will get that from I. Hisham, 3.225-6; Waqidi, 441-3.
Here is another one:
Quote:
God抯 Messenger抯 sagacity and military genius showed themselves once more during this war. He had kept them confined within the city and stationed them in a way that they could safeguard their homes against possible attacks from Banu Qurayza. It was the most critical moments of the war when Banu Qurayza sent a man into the city to spy into the conditions of the Muslim women. However, when this man was killed by Safiyya, the Prophet抯 aunt, their hopes were frustrated.
You'll get that from I. Hisham, 3.230; I. Kathir, al-Bidaya, 4.116.
Volume 5, Book 59, Number 362:
Narrated Ibn Umar:
Bani An-Nadir and Bani Quraiza fought (against the Prophet violating their peace treaty), so the Prophet exiled Bani An-Nadir and allowed Bani Quraiza to remain at their places (in Medina) taking nothing from them till they fought against the Prophet again) . He then killed their men and distributed their women, children and property among the Muslims, but some of them came to the Prophet and he granted them safety, and they embraced Islam. He exiled all the Jews from Medina. They were the Jews of Bani Qainuqa', the tribe of 'Abdullah bin Salam and the Jews of Bani Haritha and all the other Jews of Medina.
As you can see all the above hadiths showed that Hypocrite Jews had violated the peace treaty.
Got to chow... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Originally posted by Iman_6 at 30-6-2006 04:51 PM
To the hyporite liars out there,
Its not your fault.. thats how you were raised.
of course both also show that Muhammad murdered all the adult males from the Jewish tribe banu qurayza.. who hold on to their monotheistic religion.
this shows your dishonesty.. one of the link is exact copy of the one found in faithfreedom.org library which i post earliar.. and yet you condemn the one from faithfreedom.org .. pathetic lah
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/sira/index.htm
Did you know how Muhammad and gang dicide who is an adult male and who is a male child?
read this.. its crazy Sunan Abu DauBook 38, Number 4390:
Narrated Atiyyah al-Qurazi: I was among the captives of Banu Qurayzah. They (the Companions) examined us, and those who had begun to grow hair (pubes) were killed, and those who had not were not killed. I was among those who had not grown hair.
color]
[ Last edited by FaithHealer3 at 30-6-2006 05:34 PM ] |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
[quote]Originally posted by Iman_6 at 28-6-2006 02:41 PM
This is from the Sinner website as provided by Faithhealer,
-----------------------------
QUOTE:
At noon of the same day Gabriel came to the apostle, wearing a silken turban and riding on a mule saddled with brocade. He said, 'Hast thou put away thy arms, apostle of Allah?' He replied, 'Yes', and Gabriel said, 'But the angels have not yet put away theirs. I have come here to call the people to follow the command of Allah and march against the Banu Qurayza. I go myself to make them tremble
------------------------------
This is just the intro, and you can just imagine how the rest of the articles look like |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| |
|
Post time 28-6-2006 11:04 AM
