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Originally posted by sparrow at 28-7-2006 09:50 PM
So he is not a son of God...he is a prophet. And..of course he is son of Man because he is Mary's son.
Well, the Bible said many times He is Son of God. And Jesus Himself said He is the only Be ...
Don't think I am stupid..I read many times in the Bible where Jesus was called Son of Man.You think I am like you?. I won't make any commentaries upon this if I don't read the Bible.
I am not like you...I m not rejected all the verses that you have shown me(but I make my own commentaries upon them)...But you rejected all the Quranic verses that I have given to you. :p 
[ Last edited by eastrun at 29-7-2006 02:09 PM ] |
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Originally posted by sparrow at 28-7-2006 09:46 PM
sigh.. read my post again. Well, to simplify things, instead of long long lengthy sentences (which you don't seem to be able to read):
Jesus IS God.
Jesus's words = God's Words.
ie, ...
You should read my post and your post again...the meaning of Revelation, Deutronomy chapter 18:18 and etc. I thought I able to clarify you by making long explanations, but looks like you are quite confused with the 2 in 1 Jesus.
Read Revelation 1:1 once again...if Jesus is God, how can another God give him the prophecies?
"Revelation(Prophecies) of Jesus, which GOD gave into him......". If he himself is God, should not have words God gave into him...Very clear...in your own book.
When you read Deutronomy 18:18,
God said " He will put His words in his (prophet) mouth..". If Jesus is God and able to uttered his own words, what for he( Jesus that you assumed God) wanted to put his words into the promised prophet mouth?.
Ha...main - main lagi dengan 2 dalam 1..Like Shampoo...  |
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Originally posted by eastrun at 29-7-2006 01:57 PM
Read Revelation 1:1 once again...if Jesus is God, how can another God give him the prophecies?
No no.. it is not "another" God. I've already explained it above.. God is Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
Jesus IS God.. but Jesus is not the Father. The Father, and Jesus, and the Holy Spirit, are separate distinct Personalities, but is one and the same Being - ie, God.
No, it's not that i main-main.. but that's what the BIBLE said. It is not only what sparrow says.. but it is what the BIBLE says.
To read further on how the BIBLE actually SAYS about this, here's a ink - with all the verse references:
http://www.dianedew.com/godhead.htm
[ Last edited by sparrow at 29-7-2006 05:26 PM ] |
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Originally posted by eastrun at 29-7-2006 01:57 PM
Don't think I am stupid..I read many times in the Bible where Jesus was called Son of Man.You think I am like you?. I won't make any commentaries upon this if I don't read the Bible.
I am ...
I didn't say you are stupid. I just said your conclusions are not parallel to the Bible, as you claimed.
Well, the Bible said that He is Son of Man. And the Bible said that He is the only Begotten Son of God too. HE is BOTH Son of Man and Son of God. (i've given you a list of verses up there where Jesus said He is the onl Begotten Son of God.
but you claimed otherwise. You said Jesus is Son of Man.. but you said Jesus is not the Son of God. And you say, He's not Begotten. - now this conclusion of yours here is contradictory to the Bible.
So, your second conclusion here, is NOT based on the Bible.
p/s: well, i'm not trying to make you accept the Bible here. All i'm saying here is that.. don't say your conclusions are based on the Bible, when it is clearly not. |
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Originally posted by sparrow at 29-7-2006 05:13 PM
I didn't say you are stupid. I just said your conclusions are not parallel to the Bible, as you claimed.
Well, the Bible said that He is Son of Man. And the Bible said that He is the only Be ...
From the beginning I told you that I made the conclusions from both Quran and Bible...I'm not saying from Quran alone.
When the Bible said that he is Son of Man, I agreed..because he is son of Mary..when Bible said Son of God I also agreed...because..son is not really meaning son, but a peacemaker. God claimed Jesus the only begotten Son, because the way of his birth..the miraculous birth. That makes he different than other prophets. All prophets are begotten...I have made the commentaries before..
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"Behold! the angels said: "O Mary! Allah hath chosen thee and purified thee- chosen thee above the women of all nations.
"O Mary! worship Thy Lord devoutly: Prostrate thyself, and bow down (in prayer) with those who bow down"
"This is part of the tidings of the things unseen, which We reveal unto thee (O Messenger.) by inspiration: Thou wast not with them when they cast lots with arrows, as to which of them should be charged with the care of Mary: Nor wast thou with them when they disputed (the point)."
"Behold! the angels said: "O Mary! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary, held in honour in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah."
"He shall speak to the people in childhood and in maturity. And he shall be (of the company) of the righteous"
"She said: "O my Lord! How shall I have a son when no man hath touched me?" He said: "Even so: Allah createth what He willeth: When He hath decreed a plan, He but saith to it, 'Be,' and it is!"
(Surah Al-Imran 3:42-47)
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That's why God claimed he is the only begotten son because he is so special when God sent his down....
Now I tell you...most of the conclusions are in the Final Revelation...That's why Jesus claimed that he has many tthings to give but he was not able to do it...So, Muhammad is his successor...brought down the conclusions...
"We have not sent thee (Muhammad) but as a universal (Messenger) to men, giving them glad tidings, and warning them (against sin), but most men understand not." (Surah Saba ayat 28)
You will never know the connection between the Bible and the Quran if you are not reading the Quran first..Ok
[ Last edited by eastrun at 1-8-2006 07:17 PM ] |
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oh, you finally found the thread? wow! amazing!! i tot you said it was lost?
Bravo!! :clap: clap-clap!! :clap: a big applause for eastrun!! :clap:
[ Last edited by sparrow at 1-8-2006 11:44 PM ] |
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Originally posted by sparrow at 1-8-2006 10:51 PM
oh, you finally found the thread? wow! amazing!! i tot you said it was lost?
Bravo!! :clap: clap-clap!! :clap: a big applause for eastrun!! :clap:
I am using search engine la...so wanna continue?...Please reply...:pray: |
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Originally posted by eastrun at 2-8-2006 05:41 PM
I am using search engine la...so wanna continue?...Please reply...:pray:
HAH???? u mean u went to google or some search engine to search????
first time i hear ppl do this!!! LOL..
eh, just scroll the pages la and browse laaa.. i told u it's in page 2 mah!!! |
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Originally posted by sparrow at 2-8-2006 06:02 PM
HAH???? u mean u went to google or some search engine to search????
first time i hear ppl do this!!! LOL..
eh, just scroll the pages la and browse laaa.. i told u it's in page 2 mah!!!
No la...below the site, got a search engine...I'm using that to search last 30days posts..so nak sambung ke tak nak?.I want to log out no...If nak, you reply, 2molo (insyaAllah), I'll reply... |
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Originally posted by eastrun at 1-8-2006 07:05 PM
When the Bible said that he is Son of Man, I agreed..because he is son of Mary..when Bible said Son of God I also agreed...because..son is not really meaning son,..
seriously, do you understand the meaning of the words "begotten son"? Even in the Greek language, it means this:
Transliterated Greek: Monogenes
Definition: single of its kind , only used of only sons or daughters (viewed in relation to their parents)
used of Christ, denotes the only begotten son of God
honestly, i find your arguments abit kelakar la... i was looking back at your posts, and here is what i find:
"I" (as in saya) does not mean "I".. but means someone else..
"I am" does not mean "I am".. but means something else..
"me" does not mean "me".. but means someone else..
"son" does not mean "son".. but means something else..
"begotten" does not mean "begotten".. but means something else..
you're not making any sense here, you know? you want a dictionary?
(now, who's the one main-main with words? get a dictionary please..)
[ Last edited by sparrow at 2-8-2006 11:57 PM ] |
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Originally posted by sparrow at 2-8-2006 11:32 PM
seriously, do you understand the meaning of the words "begotten son"? Even in the Greek language, it means this:
Transliterated Greek: Monogenes
Definition: single of its kind , onl ...
See the 1st meaning of the word begotten..single of its kind...I am asking..do Jesus and the Father look alike and came from one medium...Jesus is human, whereas, the Father is not..so, how can it be monogenes? So, automatically, Jesus is out for the 1st meaning of the word begotten. You always take the 2nd meaning which is weaker than the 1st one...same like the meaning of Revelation...So, who is playing around..
About the meaning of I, I know it is saya, but you should know that Jesus loved to say something spiritually and hard to be understood..like I said..maybe when he said I, it can be his teaching and etc. And about I for the Revelation, I explained to you before that it is God's I, not Jesus's..because the word I is thrown into Jesus mouth from God..
I explained them all before...so please read again...
For me the begotten(memperanakkan) is mengutus...I explained that before..
Before I go...
"If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah., never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter He will be in the ranks of those who have lost (All spiritual good)." (Surah Al-Imran 3:85)
[ Last edited by eastrun at 3-8-2006 05:50 PM ] |
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Originally posted by eastrun at 3-8-2006 05:47 PM
so, how can it be monogenes?
Well, if you want to know something, the word monogenes didn't come from me. It did not come from any translator either.
The Bible was ORIGINALLY written in GREEK. The word monogenhvß (pronounced monogenes) was the ORIGINAL word there in the Greek Bible. The word "begotten" is translated from monogenhvß. Not the other way round, like what you think. In other words, monogenhvß was the true original word, and the meaning is obvious if you understand Greek (or if you look it up in a Greek dictionary)
[ Last edited by sparrow at 3-8-2006 11:51 PM ] |
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Originally posted by eastrun at 3-8-2006 05:47 PM
You always take the 2nd meaning which is weaker than the 1st one...
About the meaning of I, I know it is saya, but you should know that Jesus loved to say something spiritually and hard to be understood..like I said..maybe when he said
...
come on.. who's taking the weaker meanings here? How can my literal, straightforward and clear-cut definition of "I" be weaker than yours? Your interpretation is just a "maybe".. mine is the literal, staightforward and clear cut definition, the same way the whole world understand it to be, and listed in every english dictionary..
tell me... how is mine be weaker than yours? |
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psssst.. eastrun!
got your pm. now quick.. read and reply before it disappears off the page again!
wahahahaa... really kelakar la u... |
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Originally posted by sparrow at 5-8-2006 08:31 PM
psssst.. eastrun!
got your pm. now quick.. read and reply before it disappears off the page again!
wahahahaa... really kelakar la u...
Got the thread back..
What I have said about the stronger meaning is the word begotten and revelation which you loved very much to choose the second meaning which is weaker than the first one and by seeing the 1st meaning, you arguements about the two words are out already.
Whatever it is...the word begotten means MONOGENE in ENGLISH.Yes I know that the Bible was written in Hebrew and your scholar translated the word into begotten and get confused about the word they have translated.So...who made the mistake?... |
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Originally posted by eastrun at 7-8-2006 06:45 PM
Got the thread back..
What I have said about the stronger meaning is the word begotten and revelation which you loved very much to choose the second meaning which is weaker than the first one ...
Friend.. the New Testament was written in Greek, not Hebrew.
Monogenes is a Greek word. Not English word. |
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Originally posted by eastrun at 7-8-2006 06:45 PM
Got the thread back..
LOL... :D |
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Originally posted by sparrow at 7-8-2006 07:45 PM
Friend.. the New Testament was written in Greek, not Hebrew.
Monogenes is a Greek word. Not English word.
Sorry...type it wrongly already...yes the word Monogenes is in Greek, but when you translate it into English...It is begotten and begotten in the stronger meaning is SINGLE OF IT KIND. Where as, Jesus is human and God is in unthinkable form. They are not "Single of its kind". |
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Originally posted by eastrun at 7-8-2006 09:09 PM
Sorry...type it wrongly already...yes the word Monogenes is in Greek, but when you translate it into English...It is begotten and begotten in the stronger meaning is SINGLE OF IT KIND. Where ...
Unfortunately, my friend, the meaning of "single of its kind" was originally brought by the GREEK word, "monogenes".. even BEFORE the word "begotten son" was translated from it.
Here's the definition of "monogenes":
Original greek: monogenhvß
Transliterated greek: monogenes
Definition : single of its kind, only
used of only sons or daughters (viewed in relation to their parents)
used of Christ, denotes the only begotten son of God
By the way, the Greek word "Monogenes", when translated to English is not "begotten".
Monogenes, when translated to English, means "begotten son" , not just begotten.
[ Last edited by sparrow at 8-8-2006 06:00 AM ] |
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Originally posted by sparrow at 7-8-2006 10:09 PM
Unfortunately, my friend, the meaning of "single of its kind" was originally brought by the GREEK word, "monogenes".. even BEFORE the word "begotten son" was tra ...
So what for you follow the translated one?. Since the original language is Greek, "Single of its kind", then why you follow the translated "begotten son" which is not the original language of the New Testament.I really wonder if the word translation make the Christians believe that Jesus is the son of God...bahaya tu.... |
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Author
Post time 29-7-2006 02:34 PM
