Palestine - who owns it?

sonny~~

there u r

no jew luvers can substantiate their hecklins with HARDfacts

thumb up to KENNY, MOD ARIYA, SONNY etc who can counter all hecklins from jew luvers with HARDfacts  

:clap:  :clap:  :clap:  :clap:  :clap:  :clap:  :clap:  :clap:

[ Last edited by sonny~~ on 26-10-2004 at 11:47 PM ]

i've never been interested in discusting matters like this...but this topic just suddenly come to my attention...

referring from earlier post by debmey israel occupied the land from the native, just like the americans occupied america from the red indians...so that make it israel land...then came along all the forces that occupied that land from roman empire to the islam...

then from posts after that many of you post about the 1900s where israel is fighting with palestine on the land...then the israel won it...which ofcourse mean they occupied the land again...

so the fact is from the beggining the land belongs to who occupied it...and the first to occupied it was israel and also the last to occupied it is also  israel...but it was stopped halfway because of the un

to make it short historically israel owns palestine...
then now they occupied it...which also mean they own palestine...
isn't that how it goes
:stp:

sonny~~

nice try mr wise guy ME

thats not the way it goes

lemme elaborate - the earliest settlers of PALESTINE is the canaanites.  then PALESTINE changed hands many times n ends up with PALESTINIANS bein natives there.  these PALESTINIANS made up of majority muslim possibly arabs, christians possibly arabs, jews etc

then along came colonial mastger britain who made forked tongue promises first to arabs, then to jews.  folowin britain's forked tongue promises, arabs/PALESTINIANS n jews started squabblin bout PALESTINE

then un came in to divide PALESTINE so that israel can exist.  arabs/PALESTINIANS dont agree with the partition coz un didnt take into account the plight of PALESTINIAN natives who left at mercy of imported jews/isralis in that part of PALESTINE that has become israel

so the conflict persists till now

if u were to say PALESTINE is israelis' land, then u're wrong.  PALESTINE is for PALESTINIANS.  israel for israelis  

peace

nightlord

Sonny you have been smoking weed again huh.

Why dont you start posting some HARDfacts instead of hecklin someone else's logic.

Try dating some of the events and you will see how long the jews have occupied the land compared to the ARABS. A few thousand to a few hundred.

So if you think that Israel should hand back the land to the ARABS, then why dont you try convincing the Malaysian govt of handing back to the PriBumis or America to the RED INDIAN.

Your logic have always stank of low IQ.


nightlord.

Try dating some of the events and you will see how long the jews have occupied the land compared to the ARABS.

----------

Occupied?  If we want to use the word "occupied" than the Hittites, the Canaanites, the Philistines have more right than the Jews.  After all the Jews fled from Egypt and ran over Canaan...and David took Jerusalem from the Jebusites..no?  "Israel" was not inhabited then, there were already various tribes living there and civilised (potteries, use of iron etc).

I think the right word to use would be "in possession" or "rule(d)".  Then you will see that the Jews only had Samaria and Judah (not the entire Palestine) for a short time, slightly over 400 years.  The Muslims ie Caliph Omar, the Ayubbid, the Mamluk and the Ottoman combined ruled Palestine for over 1000 years.  The modern Israel existed only for less than 60 years.

And Palestinian never ruled Palestine/Palaistina.

sonny~~

Originally posted by nightlord at 2004-11-2 11:52 PM:
Try dating some of the events and you will see how long the jews have occupied the land compared to the ARABS. A few thousand to a few hundred.

lets c ur dates how long jews occupied PALESTINE, how long arabs occuped PALESTINE, how long PALESTINIANS occupied PALESTINE.  am waitin

So if you think that Israel should hand back the land to the ARABS, then why dont you try convincing the Malaysian govt of handing back to the PriBumis or America to the RED INDIAN.

commonsense tells u israel should hand over occupied PALESTINIAN territories NOT to arabs BUTT to PALESTINIANS

me talkin bout PALESTINE or that part of PALESTINE which supposedly for PALESTINIANS

that part of PALESTINE which un has divided so that israel can exist, is no more in the picture now.  its kaput.  gone case.  get that into ur thick skull

no twistin n distortin me postins to suit ur deceptive self  :no:

sonny~~

NIGHTLORD, ADMIRAL try read with ur brain up there not down there plz  :cak:

Originally posted by samerosie at 2004-11-3 03:47 PM:
Try dating some of the events and you will see how long the jews have occupied the land compared to the ARABS.

----------

Occupied?  If we want to use the word "occupied" than the Hittites, the Canaanites, the Philistines have more right than the Jews.  After all the Jews fled from Egypt and ran over Canaan...and David took Jerusalem from the Jebusites..no?  "Israel" was not inhabited then, there were already various tribes living there and civilised (potteries, use of iron etc).

I think the right word to use would be "in possession" or "rule(d)".  Then you will see that the Jews only had Samaria and Judah (not the entire Palestine) for a short time, slightly over 400 years.  The Muslims ie Caliph Omar, the Ayubbid, the Mamluk and the Ottoman combined ruled Palestine for over 1000 years.  The modern Israel existed only for less than 60 years.

sonny~~

Originally posted by Adm_Cheng_Ho at 2004-11-4 09:04 AM:
And Palestinian never ruled Palestine/Palaistina.

PALETINIANS may not RULE PALESTINE

but PALESTINIANS LIVE in PALESTINE

history tells u PALESTINE rulers change hands many times
one of rulers is ottoman empire then britain

britain's forked tongue promises first to arabs then to jews has resulted in current israeli PALESTINIAN conflict

u wanna counter me HARDfacts, by all means.  but do so with HARDfacts too

no hecklin  

peace

nightlord

Well Sonny why dont you try this HARDfacts out for size?


Quote :
Who owns the land? The Palestinians have a bizarre claim that they are owners of Israel and that they should have their own nation - Palestine. It should be noted that there was never such nation as Palestine. The area known as Palestine was Israel but renamed to Palestine by the Romans as an insult to the Jews because Palestine simply meant land of the Philistines.

After AD 70, the Jews lost their land politically but they still maintained a presence in the land despite foreign control by the Romans, Ottoman Turks, the Crusaders, the Turks, and then the British. The land of Israel was under foreign control and was never made into an independent nation until 1948.

The term "Palestinian" is confusing because before 1948, this term not only referred to Arabs but to Jews as well as Christians living in the region of Palestine. It is peculiar that the "Palestinian" identity of the Arabs in Israel did not emerge until 1968; 20 years after Israel became a nation. If Palestinians, who supposedly have a right to the land, are correct then why did they wait 20 years to simply confirm their identity? The fact is there is no such thing as a Palestinian nationality.  

Facts will prove that even some "Palestinian" leaders are not Palestinians as they so claim.  Look at the nationality of Yassir Arafat. He is not a Palestinian for he was born in Cairo, Egypt even though he has claimed he was born in Jerusalem.

What about the refugee problem concerning the Palestinians? The facts are when Israel became a nation in 1948; the Arab nations told the Arabs living in Israel to flee because they believed that they would have a quick victory over the Jews. This never happened and these so-called refugees had no homes. But the facts are that the total number of refugees are inflated as many Arabs flooded into Israel after 1948 and they were counted as refugees. Also while the number of refugee births was taken, the number of refugee deaths was not. Even now the Palestinians will not allow a census to be taken of the refugees.

Another group of refugees that we neglect to look into are the Jewish refugees who left vast amounts of wealth and property behind in Arab nations (which Arab nations confiscated) in order to flee to their beloved Israel where they knew that they would receive a better life there instead of being a discriminated minority in Arab nations.

Arab nations have the full capabilities of taking in Palestinian refugees and assimilating them into their nations but they refuse to do so (except Jordan). These refugees are simply used as pawns by their own brothers - the Arabs in order for this refugee problem to a thorn in Israel's side. Arab nations know that the world will look with disdain over Israel's supposed "maltreatment" of refugees. If Israel is being a little hard on the refugees, this is minimal compared to the centuries of brutality that the Jews suffered at the hands of Muslims.

This manipulation by the Arabs to the refugees lead the refugees to resort to violence and terrorist acts because they have nothing to lose and believing the lie that their Arab brothers care for their welfare. Promise them paradise if they shed innocent blood. Promise them beautiful virgin girls if they kill the infidel - the Jews. This is religious fundamentalism at its worst!

The fact is that the existence of Israel is an affront to the supposed supremacy of Israel over the infidel - the Jews. Israel is only 0.005% of the total landmass of the Middle East. This is half of one percent. Muslims claim Jerusalem is the third holiest city in Islam. The claim that Jerusalem is found in the Qur'an in Surah 17:1. The reference to Jerusalem is the "farthest mosque" where Muhammad was taken on a journey at night by Allah. Muslims identify this mosque as the Al-Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem. This is ironic because this mosque was built 6 years after Muhammad died. Before this mosque, a Christian church stood over the destroyed Temple Mount. This means that the Muslim's view of Surah 17:1 is pure assumption because history proves them wrong. How can Muhammad travel to a mosque not even built yet until after his death?

Arabs will neither sleep nor rest until Israel is pushed into the sea. Why? Because Allah decreed this. Because Allah rejected the Jews. Based on this I'm glad I don't serve Allah. I serve the God (Yahweh) of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob who is a Trinity of the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit.

God has stated that He has not forgotten Israel and there are many scriptures in the Old Testament, which attest to the restoration of Israel when the Messiah returns. Ultimately the nations will be gathered against Jerusalem (Zechariah 14:2) but the Messiah will come and crush her enemies with the sound of His Word.

End Quote.



nightlord

A few things to add to Nightlord's excellent post.

The Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan took Palestinian in because they are Jordan's subject. When Israel is proclaimed, Arab League took Samarria and Judea and gave it to Jordan. It was then renamed West Bank. That's why although the land is located on the east of Israel, but it is called West Bank because it is a province located on the west of Jordan. They stopped taking in the Palestinian because these people outnumber the Hashemites. Arabs consists of many tribes as we know. Palestinians are not Hashemites.

One more thing is there was the greatest locust plague in modern history in that region where it wiped out about 40,000 people. The majority Arabs left the area and did not come back till 1922-1924. So, you can see here, they do not have historical attachment to the land. Far from it. The land was never belong to them at all. They never ruled it.

sonny~~

Originally posted by nightlord at 2004-11-5 12:43 AM:
Well Sonny why dont you try this HARDfacts out for size?


Quote :
Who owns the land? The Palestinians have a bizarre claim that they are owners of Israel and that they should have their own nation - Palestine. It should be noted that there was never such nation as Palestine. The area known as Palestine was Israel but renamed to Palestine by the Romans as an insult to the Jews because Palestine simply meant land of the Philistines

me gonna go one step at a time
first me wanna show ur ignorance in first para of ur postin.  me gonna response to rest of ur postin later when am free

yup, PALESTINE was israel at ONE time, me repeat - at ONE time.  bfore israel owned PALESTINE, its canaanites' land then sumbody, then sumbody etc.  after romans changed israel to PALESTINE, its owned by sumbody else, then sumbody else n lastly PALESTINE is owned by PALESTINIANS.

lets go thru HARDfacts.  n lets c u counter me HARDfacts with ur HARDfacts.  am waitin  

peace

3'rd millennium BC : The Canaanites were the earliest known inhabitants of Palestine. no israel yet

2'rd millennium BC : Egyptian hegemony and Canaanite autonomy were constantly challenged by such ethnically diverse invaders as the Amorites, Hittites, and Hurrians.  no israel yet

14th century BC : Egyptian power began to weaken, new invaders appeared: the Hebrews, a group of Semitic tribes from Mesopotamia, and the Philistines (after whom the country was later named), an Aegean people of Indo-European stock. yup israel around in the name of jews.  PALESTINE not totally owned by israelis/jews

1230 BC : Joshua conquered parts of Palestine. The conquerors settled in the hill country, but they were unable to conquer all of Palestine.  israel is found in part of PALESTINE.  PALESTINE not totally owned by israelis/jews

1125 BC : The Israelites, a confederation of Hebrew tribes, finally defeated the Canaanites but found the struggle with the Philistines more difficult . Philistines had established an independent state on the southern coast of Palestine and controlled the Canaanite town of Jerusalem.  israel is found in part of PALESTINE.  PALESTINE not totally owned by israelis/jews

1050 BC : Philistines with there superior in military organization and using iron weapons, they severely defeated the Israelites about 1050 BC . israel no more a part of PALESTINE

1000 BC : David, Israel's great king, finally defeated the Philistines, and they eventually assimilated with the Canaanites.  only now, this ONE time, israelis owned PALESTINE

922 BC : Under David's son and successor, Solomon, Israel enjoyed peace and prosperity , but at his death in 922 BC the kingdom was divided into Israel in the north and Judah in the south . israel is only a part of PALESTINE

722-721 BC : When nearby empires resumed their expansion, the divided Israelites could no longer maintain their independence . Israel fell to Assyria. israel out of PALESTINE

586 BC : Judah was conquered by Babylonia, which destroyed Jerusalem and exiled most of the Jews living there. Nebuchadnezzar entered Jerusalem.  israel dont exist no more

539 BC : Cyrus the Great of Persia conquered Babylonia and he permitted the Jews to return to Judea, a district of Palestine. Under Persian rule the Jews were allowed considerable autonomy.  israel only has autonomy by cyrus' grace

333 BC : Persian domination of Palestine was replaced by Greek rule when Alexander the Great of Macedonia took the region.

141-63 BC : Jews revolted under the Maccabees and set up an independent state.  israelis may or may not own PALESTINE.  u read the followin date

132-35 BC : Jews revolts erupted, numerous Jews were killed, many were sold into slavery, and the rest were not allowed to visit Jerusalem. Judea was renamed Syria Palaistina.  israel dont control PALESTINE no more

63 BC : Jerusalem was overrun by Rome

29-614 AD : Byzantine (Roman) rule was interrupted , however , by a brief Persian occupation and ended altogether when Muslim Arab armies invaded Palestine and captured Jerusalem in AD 638 .

638 AD : The Arab conquest began 1300 years of Muslim presence in what then became known as Filastin.  as u can c, israel owned PALESTINE only at ONE time.  now PALESTINE is owned by arabs/PALESTINIANS

sonny~~

Originally posted by Adm_Cheng_Ho at 2004-11-5 08:23 AM:
A few things to add to Nightlord's excellent post.

The Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan took Palestinian in because they are Jordan's subject. When Israel is proclaimed, Arab League took Samarria and ...

the HARDbottom line israel owned PALESTINE at ONE time only

now PALESTINE is owned by PALESTINIANS the majority of whom r muslims possibly arabs, christians possibly arabs, jews etc

only by un's moron grace that israel is able to exist agin by dividin PALESTINE

dont try to distract NIGHTLORDs deceptive postin  :no:

Originally posted by sonny~~ at 2004-11-5 01:22 PM:


the HARDbottom line israel owned PALESTINE at ONE time only

now PALESTINE is owned by PALESTINIANS the majority of whom r muslims possibly arabs, christians possibly arabs, jews etc

only  ...

Thanx for the very thorough and clear chronology of events, Sonny.;)  It proves how illegitimate the Israeli occupation/claim is.

o yeah...them muslim arabs hypocrites...


The history of the state of Israel, from 1517 to the present.

Between 1517 and 1917, the Ottoman Empire of Turkey controlled the areas of Lebanon, Syria, and Palestine. Supporting Germany during the First World War, the Turks were defeated and in 1916, the southern portion of control was mandated to Britain and France - Lebanon and Syria going to France, with Palestine (the areas known today as Israel, Jordan, and the West Bank) controlled by the British. Jews had begun mass immigration to Palestine during the 1880抯 and slowly started changing the very landscape from malarial swamps and dry desserts to farmable land. This also attracted a large number of Arab immigrants who were looking for employment and better living conditions.

The arabs sure can smell oppotunities...

In 1923 Palestine was divided into two areas by the British

sonny~~

Originally posted by me at 2004-11-6 10:38 AM:
o yeah...them muslim arabs hypocrites...


The history of the state of Israel, from 1517 to the present.

Between 1517 and 1917, the Ottoman Empire of Turkey controlled the areas of Lebanon, S ...

u bein deceptive agin mr wise guy ME

lets get HARDfacts straight

un didnt divide PALESTINE 50 50.  un gave 56.47% of PALESTINE to jews so that israel can exist, n 43.53% of PALESTINE to PALESTINIANS

followin 1967 war, israel took 77% of PALESTINE (israel n occupied PALESTINIAN territories)

whos greedy 'ere?  israelis or PALESTINIANS?  am waitin  

peace  

Summary of UN General Assembly Resolution 181
November 29, 1947

The territory of Palestine should be divided as follows:

A Jewish State covering 56.47% of Mandatory Palestine (excluding Jerusalem) with a population of 498,000 Jews and 325,000 Arabs;

An Arab State covering 43.53% of Mandatory Palestine (excluding Jerusalem), with 807,000 Arab inhabitants and 10,000 Jewish inhabitants;

An international trusteeship regime in Jerusalem, where the population was 100,000 Jews and 105,000 Arabs.


1947-1977  

After looking at various alternatives, the UN proposed the partitioning of Palestine into two independent States, one Palestinian Arab and the other Jewish, with Jerusalem internationalized (Resolution 181 (II) of 1947).  One of the two States envisaged in the partition plan proclaimed its independence as Israel and in the 1948 war expanded to occupy 77 per cent of the territory of Palestine. Israel also occupied the larger part of Jerusalem. Over half the indigenous Palestinian population fled or were expelled. Jordan and Egypt occupied the other parts of the territory assigned by the partition resolution to the Palestinian Arab State which did not come into being.

nightlord

Aduh bodohnya sonny.

Next time you leave your house vacant, I will move in and call it my home.
Then you cannot have it back.lol

Allah gave Palestine to the jews, dont you get it.

Allah is the god of Abraham, thus god of jews, christians and muslims.

And what Allah proclaim dont you smart ass say something else:no:



nightlord

sonny~~

Originally posted by nightlord at 2004-11-7 01:19 AM:
Aduh bodohnya sonny.

Next time you leave your house vacant, I will move in and call it my home.
Then you cannot have it back.lol

Allah gave Palestine to the jews, dont you get it.

Al ...

u believe in allah or trinity?  choose between the 2

wheres ur HARDproof to counter me HARDproof that israel owned PALESTINE from 3rd millennium bc till un divided PALESTINE in 1948?  where?

where bible says god gives PALESTINE to israel or un gives part of PALESTINE to israel?  where?  am waitin.  no hecklin now  :no:  

3'rd millennium BC : The Canaanites were the earliest known inhabitants of Palestine. no israel yet

2'rd millennium BC : Egyptian hegemony and Canaanite autonomy were constantly challenged by such ethnically diverse invaders as the Amorites, Hittites, and Hurrians.  no israel yet

14th century BC : Egyptian power began to weaken, new invaders appeared: the Hebrews, a group of Semitic tribes from Mesopotamia, and the Philistines (after whom the country was later named), an Aegean people of Indo-European stock. yup israel around in the name of jews.  PALESTINE not totally owned by israelis/jews

1230 BC : Joshua conquered parts of Palestine. The conquerors settled in the hill country, but they were unable to conquer all of Palestine.  israel is found in part of PALESTINE.  PALESTINE not totally owned by israelis/jews

1125 BC : The Israelites, a confederation of Hebrew tribes, finally defeated the Canaanites but found the struggle with the Philistines more difficult . Philistines had established an independent state on the southern coast of Palestine and controlled the Canaanite town of Jerusalem.  israel is found in part of PALESTINE.  PALESTINE not totally owned by israelis/jews

1050 BC : Philistines with there superior in military organization and using iron weapons, they severely defeated the Israelites about 1050 BC . israel no more a part of PALESTINE

1000 BC : David, Israel's great king, finally defeated the Philistines, and they eventually assimilated with the Canaanites.  only now, this ONE time, israelis owned PALESTINE

922 BC : Under David's son and successor, Solomon, Israel enjoyed peace and prosperity , but at his death in 922 BC the kingdom was divided into Israel in the north and Judah in the south . israel is only a part of PALESTINE

722-721 BC : When nearby empires resumed their expansion, the divided Israelites could no longer maintain their independence . Israel fell to Assyria. israel out of PALESTINE

586 BC : Judah was conquered by Babylonia, which destroyed Jerusalem and exiled most of the Jews living there. Nebuchadnezzar entered Jerusalem.  israel dont exist no more

539 BC : Cyrus the Great of Persia conquered Babylonia and he permitted the Jews to return to Judea, a district of Palestine. Under Persian rule the Jews were allowed considerable autonomy.  israel only has autonomy by cyrus' grace

333 BC : Persian domination of Palestine was replaced by Greek rule when Alexander the Great of Macedonia took the region.

141-63 BC : Jews revolted under the Maccabees and set up an independent state.  israelis may or may not own PALESTINE.  u read the followin date

132-35 BC : Jews revolts erupted, numerous Jews were killed, many were sold into slavery, and the rest were not allowed to visit Jerusalem. Judea was renamed Syria Palaistina.  israel dont control PALESTINE no more

63 BC : Jerusalem was overrun by Rome

29-614 AD : Byzantine (Roman) rule was interrupted , however , by a brief Persian occupation and ended altogether when Muslim Arab armies invaded Palestine and captured Jerusalem in AD 638 .

638 AD : The Arab conquest began 1300 years of Muslim presence in what then became known as Filastin.  as u can c, israel owned PALESTINE only at ONE time.  now PALESTINE is owned by arabs/PALESTINIANS

sonny~~

Originally posted by KENNKID at 2004-11-5 02:23 PM:


Thanx for the very thorough and clear chronology of events, Sonny.;)  It proves how illegitimate the Israeli occupation/claim is.

:tq:

Seraphim

Originally posted by sonny~~ at 7-11-2004 09:23 AM:


u believe in allah or trinity?  choose between the 2

wheres ur HARDproof to counter me HARDproof that israel owned PALESTINE from 3rd millennium bc till un divided PALESTINE in 1948?  where? ...

Sonny boy...Your remark (which is in red) is exceedingly downright-to-earth rueful....PLease..i mean do please read the origin of the name palestine..Do please Sonny...

http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_early_palestine_name_origin.php

Dont make yourself look silly each time you post...A friendly advice..